And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end (Ecclesiastes 12:12) A pdf version of this essay can be downloaded here [*] Years in brackets refer to an individual’s or book author’s year of birth Thought experiment for the day: Anyone born 1945 would be pushing towards 80 and mostly past their prime. So name any Charedi sefer written by someone born post war that has or is likely to enter the canon, be it haloche, lomdus, al hatorah or mussar. Single one will do for now — IfYouTickleUs (@ifyoutickleus) July 27, 2022 A tweet in the summer which gained some traction asked for a book by an author born from 1945 onwards that has entered the Torah and rabbinic canon or is heading in that direction. I didn't exactly phrase it this way and some quibbled about 'canonisation'. The word does indeed have a precise meaning though in its popular use it has no narrow definition. Canonisation, or ‘entering the canon’ is generally understood to
Due to this morning's arrests the position with comments has become further complicated due to sub-judice (pronounced, sub JEW dc) rules. For some helpful guidance please see the following links:
http://www.channel4.com/producers-handbook/media-law/contempt-and-reporting-legal-proceedings/contempt-or-sub-judice-rules
http://www.out-law.com/page-9742
Please read carefully before you comment. Editing comments is horribly time consuming and if there is any doubt the comment will not be published.
If there is a media lawyer reading this and is able to assist please can you make yourself known by email.
There is however no reason why there cannot be a sensible discussion on how we got to where we are and the many repercussions to the community of the current situation. So please do not give in to those who would like to silence us and do contribute to this very important debate.
Be heard not herded.
http://www.channel4.com/producers-handbook/media-law/contempt-and-reporting-legal-proceedings/contempt-or-sub-judice-rules
http://www.out-law.com/page-9742
Please read carefully before you comment. Editing comments is horribly time consuming and if there is any doubt the comment will not be published.
If there is a media lawyer reading this and is able to assist please can you make yourself known by email.
There is however no reason why there cannot be a sensible discussion on how we got to where we are and the many repercussions to the community of the current situation. So please do not give in to those who would like to silence us and do contribute to this very important debate.
Be heard not herded.
Um... Lovely weather today...
ReplyDeleteDoesn't the discussion also have to fit charity commission guidelines?
ReplyDeleteThis course of events was so predictable. Why oh why did they resort to this action against Google? Why did otherwise sensible people become entranced by this course of action?
ReplyDeleteI, and others said in previous posts that going to the secular courts would trigger these circumstances. Others, of the opposite view, dismissed these statements as fantasy.
Presumably, at some point, Mrs Justice Gloster may see the dangers of allowing an application against Google, where there is no-one present to put the case for the other side. Audi alterem partem used to be important in English Law.
You are not obliged to say anything but anything you say may be used as evidence in any future proceedings .
ReplyDeleteIf you say nothing your silence may be referred to in any future proceedings.
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletewhy dont you ever print my comments?
ReplyDeleteIt's not fair! I dont say anything wrong.
There were these bad guys. God saved us from them.
ReplyDeleteGood Purim to one and all
Where does this leave the BD?
ReplyDeleteWere those whe were allededgedly arrested bailed yet?
ReplyDeleteIf not will they have a minyan for Zochoir & Megilah?
Do they have a baaal korah?
Off topic does DCGG still have a minyan,did they have one every day?
Now on the Beeb:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-21530115
Are those arrested still in police custody?
ReplyDeleteCurious said...
ReplyDeleteAre those arrested still in police custody?
As of this am it seems
http://www.bhol.co.il/article.aspx?id=51225
Yes, the hearings are taking place now in Hendon Magistrates Court.
ReplyDeleteCan I remind the Kehilla of the severe dangers our children face, as highlighted by Shomrim a year ago. http://twitpic.com/8rxmu5
ReplyDelete"Children will be pre-occupied with their costumes...they may not be conscious of the dangers the streets bring"
Great. Now our children are equipped with the seichel to stay safe. I wonder what advice Shomrim might have for adults obsessed with costumes and appearance?
Anonymous, do you mean:
ReplyDelete1) an application by the Police for more time (I presume thay have until tomorrow morning anyway)
2) they have been charged and are being remanded and are making an application for bail?
Are there are any reporting restrictions?
It's a closed hearing. No members of the public are allowed in.
ReplyDeleteUnclear whether they are being charged or bail.
Anonymous, please keep us updated. Should the mispallelim at BLBH wait for him for mincha? Will there be a lechaim after if he gets back?
ReplyDeleteWhat basis is there in UK law for a hearing like this to be closed to the public?
ReplyDeletePlease let us know whether to wait for mincha or not ..........
ReplyDeleteBBC1 6:30 tonight
ReplyDeleteBLBH Mispallel - you're a riot! LOL
ReplyDeleteAny link to updated news please?
ReplyDeleteI hope that at least the other 3 will be allowed to hear Zochoir & megilah with a minyan.
Miriam Shaviv reports a relevant piece on a 54 year old who is under arrest will be running on BBC1 at 18:30. JC says police have been given a further 36 hours for questioning by Court
ReplyDeletehttp://www.thejc.com/news/uk-news/102716/police-continue-questioning-rabbi-halpern
http://www.barnetbugle.com/journal/2013/2/21/barnet-borough-commander-adrian-usher-writes-open-letter-abo.html
ReplyDeleteIn this arid atmosphere for commenting I would like to suggest another line of discussion.
ReplyDeleteLet's get some ideas for shlach manot presents to send Mr. Chaim Halpern in his place of detention. Any ideas?
Also, any Purim costume suggestions for He Who Can Now Be Named.
Tickle,
ReplyDeleteWhen is Google's deadline up?
Hediot . .
ReplyDeleteCan we please have some leadership from our Rabbonim or Machers and arrange a NW wide Tefila or Tehillim for the Torah's and Schina's shame . . .
I heard that it took several hours to get kosher food as the meals brought were LBD which the arrested felons refused to eat.
ReplyDelete"Also, any Purim costume suggestions for He Who Can Now Be Named." How about wrapping him in an oversized towel!
ReplyDeleteIs this the end of 'Shomrim'?
ReplyDeleteI'm still waiting for someone to yell over a bullhorn, "Color War!"
ReplyDeleteThe police have been granted another 36 hours to hold all 4. Still no news on whether they are pressing charges.
ReplyDeleteTickle, did you receive a temporary reprieve from the high court?
Hediot . .
ReplyDeletePs. I refer to the young Rabonim and young askonim.
The older generation can't multi-task
Does anyone know who exactly the other 3 are? Is that also not allowed to be said publicly for fear of damaging the court proceedings?
ReplyDeleteOi veiz mir!
ReplyDeleteFor those of you who missed the BBC News broadcast about RCH. You can watch it here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_vlfwQDqRE
ReplyDeleteMaybe as Parshas Zochor and shul's are extra full for each shul to say a kapitel when they say the mi she berach for 'tzorcei tzibbur b'emunah . . .
ReplyDeleteThe inmates were given plenty of suitable kosher food
ReplyDeleteThe blog saying that it was Lbd is simply inaccurate
On arrival they were offered DD's sandwiches without delay
Since then they have had plenty to eat
The families have been allowed to liaise with them and take in fresh clothing as per normal custody procedures
What is prudent is the long stay in a police cell. Police cells are not designed for periods of over 24HR's. It is rare to get extentions.
Yomim al yemei melech tosef?
ReplyDeleteAnyone supplying hamentaschen with a file?
ReplyDeleteMeuzzin said:
ReplyDeleteHediot,-
before anyone responds to your call for prayers, check out the toichochoh from Joe Blogs (speakerscornernw11). Eichoh or Esther this year?
All the people joking about this situation:
ReplyDeleteWhichever side of the argument one is, this is a very sorry situation and not at all a laughing matter.
There are people locked up in a tiny cell having had all the liberties you and I take for granted, taken from them. It is extremely demeaning and depressing.
Plus, there are their families: wives, parents, sons, daughters, son's in law, daughters in law & extended family and friends, all worried sick. Countless innocents who have not slept for nights, people too sick with worry to be able to eat more than a few morsels.
This is supposed to be the happiest time in our year, and there are people who are suffering as nobody should ever have to suffer and people stand by cracking jokes.
Can we really be so heartless?
Before we crack the next joke, lets just think for a second about the plight of these people and their families (whether we think it deserved or otherwise) and how we would feel if we were in their position.
Then lets see if the joke is still as funny as it sounded initially.
The anonymous idiot who posted the pathetic link to the other anonymous pathetic idiot Joe Blogs.
ReplyDeleteHaving lost the main plank of their argument that 'obviously nothing took place or else the police would have got involved', these blind fools now turn their attention to 'the lack of yashrus, temimus and loshon nekiyo of the bloggers'.
Their whole yiddishkeit is venehapoch hu, black is white, up is down, CH is a tsaddik and a godol.
As the old expression goes, if you lie down with dogs, you get up with fleas.
The (equally anonymous and equally intemperate) Joe Blogs is flea ridden.
What about all the victims liberties? Not just suffering for one or two night but lifetimes
ReplyDeleteHi everyone
ReplyDeleteAny news on the four arrested?
@Realist
ReplyDeleteEverything you say is true, but why didn't the accused think of that earlier?
Had he heeded the warning of colleagues to leave last Sukkos, at least he would be abroad in a kolel in possession of his passport.
You cry about his close family. Why don't you cry for the alleged victims? Why can't they be given justice? If the allegations are true, did you know that women can feel suicidal after such an experience?
At least if he is tried and convicted, the accused might be told to do 'community service', which he is very good at.
'Here Here', Realist.
ReplyDeleteThere are a bunch of very depressed people out there who are terribly unhappy with their lives. They silently rejoice at the news of hearing anything bad happening to people from their community. Whether it is people being locked up, people getting divorced, people doing badly in business etc.
You know who you are! It's you who probably caused the whole Chilul Hashem outsise 215 GG Rd. a few weeks back when the police & Hatzolah were called in (can you believe these reshoim!).
Realist
ReplyDelete100% agree, it is a very sad day for the whole kehilloh. Those who joke about it will see worse yet for laughing.
But the defendants were all warned.
They were playing with fire by going to the secular courts. It wasn't Adar, when the mazal is good for law cases with goyim. it was parshas mishpotttim of all sedras, and still they went to the goyshe courts.
mgv -
ReplyDeleteI am sorry you feel aggrieved that my yiddishkeit is upside down, and that I am flea-ridden, intemperate and whatever else.
How exactly are you dealing with these feelings? I am dealing with mine very well!!
I did not say CH was a "tzaddik and a godol" - nor did I imply this. It is not for me to say. But if you wish to distort my post to suit your own ends, please do so. The public can read and understand my words for themselves.
Furthermore, "Joe", whereas the Ramo allows a man to masquerade as a woman on Purim, there's no such hetter to do so the whole year round, as you do.
ReplyDeleteCharvonah
ReplyDeleteYou are one hundred percent right. And by the way I am an anti not a pro.
I have sympathy for everybody concerned, but funnily enough even for the person who we all agree could have prevented all this.
http://chaimhalpernconspiracy.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/all-four-released-without-charges.html
ReplyDeleteJOE BLOGS IS A WOMAN OKAY.
ReplyDeleteI think there is a very unusual aspect of this procedure which lawyers may debate for years. The arrests related to interference with the course of justice despite the fact that the only known judicial process involved is that of the Bais Din, which is a commission of inquiry under communal auspices. Now rabbinical tribunals have standing in civil matters when an arbitration agreement is signed by two sides in a dispute. But there is no obvious reason why an independent commission be considered as a recognised judicial process. If the bais Din is not a judicial process, then payment of a gratuity to someone for not testifying is only interfering with an inquiry, which is not a crime. But if a criminal complaint has been filed by one of the victims, even if it has not been deemed credible and therefore not acted upon, such payment might be considered interfering with the course of justice. Therefore it is likely that this indicates a prior criminal complaint, which has not been deemed actionable.
ReplyDeleteSneaze Avenue:
ReplyDeleteWhy do you think that the obstruction of justice or witness intimidation which has been alleged is related to the Beis Din investigation? To the contrary, it sounds like there was a criminal investigation going on and that the police believe they are in possession of evidence that the individuals who are arrested attempted to intimidated from testfiying or otherwise discouraged from cooperation with the police. That is a very valid law for the authorities to uphold.